Kecheng Fang: Hi, you're listening to Record of Change.
Kecheng Fang: Record of Change listens to eight individuals located on every continent how their lives have been twisted by the COVID-19 pandemic.
Kecheng Fang: My name is Kacheng Fang.
Kecheng Fang: I'm talking to you from Hong Kong.
Kecheng Fang: Today, we are listening to Wenni, who is an insurance agent, and her husband, Dominic, who is a social worker.
Kecheng Fang: Both of them are now in Hong Kong and were infected with the coronavirus.
Kecheng Fang: They have recovered from the disease and kindly agreed to share their experience.
Kecheng Fang: I'd like to first ask about.
Kecheng Fang: How did you first hear about coronavirus?
Kecheng Fang: Did you hear that in January or even before that?
Wenni: I think I heard it in January and before the Chinese new year.
Wenni: Every year I will go back to my hometown, Wuxi in Jiangsu province to celebrate Chinese new year with my parents.
Wenni: But before that I heard about the coronavirus.
Wenni: So I was hesitating if I should go back, then I asked parents and they told me it's not a big
Wenni: deal, it's just a very small amount of persons who get infected and most of them are in Wuhan.
Wenni: So they asked me to go back with my husband.
Kecheng Fang: So during that time, people's perception were quite different from now, right?
Kecheng Fang: During that time, it seems that people in Hong Kong were very, very nervous, but people in mainland China were very, very relaxed.
Kecheng Fang: Is that so?
Dominic: Yeah, we heard it in January, but at that time, the situation is not severe as now.
Kecheng Fang: So I also remember during that time, people in Hong Kong seems to be talking about this virus, much more than people in mainland China.
Kecheng Fang: Was that because people in Hong Kong actually had memory of the SARS outbreak in 2003.
Kecheng Fang: Is that something that heavily influenced how people in Hong Kong perceive Corona virus this time?
Kecheng Fang: So were you in Hong Kong in 2003, Dominic?
Dominic: Yeah.
Dominic: Yeah, I was.
Dominic: Definitely.
Dominic: I think it's because of SARS we are more experienced to it.
Dominic: We took a lot more precautions, so we started to wear mask, wash hands because we experienced that, you know, in earlier days.
Dominic: So definitely it reminds us of a horrible time.
Dominic: So that's why we took a lot of precautions, you know?
Kecheng Fang: Did you go back to a hometown together during the Chinese new year, despite pandemic.
Dominic: Yeah.
Kecheng Fang: Have ever thought that you would eventually become the direct victims of the virus?
Wenni: No, since I didn't experience SARS.
Wenni: In 2003, I was in my hometown Wuxi I think few people was diagnosed with SARS.
Wenni: So it seems very far away from my life.
Wenni: So even I know the COVID-19 happened all over the world.
Wenni: I don't think it has nothing to do with me.
Wenni: I even joke with my husband.
Wenni: we won't be so unlucky to get virus.
Wenni: If we got it we should go to the luck...
Kecheng Fang: Did you buy lottery tickets?
Wenni: No, because we know we are not so lucky.
Kecheng Fang: Okay.
Kecheng Fang: Can you share us with experience of being infected with COVID-19?
Kecheng Fang: Like, how did you, and where did you get this virus?
Kecheng Fang: Do you have answers to that question or is it still actually also a mystery to you?
Dominic: Well actually it's after a trip from Canada, so the very next day, you know, I have a sore throat, few coughs and I'm slightly feverish.
Dominic: At first I thought it's probably nothing.
Dominic: It's just probably because we have had a long flight, so, you know, just probably tired, but then, you know, I just want to play safe.
Dominic: So I went to get checked in a clinic and they sent me to the hospital right away.
Dominic: And then, I stayed there for one night and then the next day, the doctor told me that, Oh, you're tested positive.
Dominic: And that moment I was quite shocked because I hardly have any symptoms.
Dominic: So, and actually I feel quite fine.
Dominic: So it's very unbelievable that, you know, I got tested positive.
Dominic: And, that might, that moment, you know, I, I told my wife to take a taxi and come to the hospital, you know, immediately to also get checked, checked out.
Dominic: And,she got tested positive too.
Dominic: So we were actually quite shocked, you know, at that time.
Wenni: I have some symptom it's hard similar, to my husband.
Wenni: I also had sore throat and the muscle pain and I feel very tired, but I just think it's maybe because of the jet lag.
Wenni: It's pretty much like a cold
Kecheng Fang: Hmm.
Kecheng Fang: was it that you, got somewhat, somehow got infected during the flight?
Wenni: we went to Canada to Toronto on 3rd of March and we stayed there for two weeks.
Wenni: cause we, needed to buy a property and do other things to prepare for our immigration.
Wenni: At that time, the situation in Canada, I mean, the COVID-19 epidemic was not very serious.
Wenni: people in Canada they even didn't wear mask.
Wenni: when we fly back to Hong Kong, the plane is full of people and the lady sitting next to me was from New York.
Wenni: I think maybe I was get infected in the plane, but, we can't find the, answer.
Kecheng Fang: So during that time, people are in the North America, they were not doing this social distancing, they're not doing this or this
Kecheng Fang: protective measures, so after you heard the news that you tested positive, were you like immediately sent to some like special hospital rooms?
Wenni: Yes.
Wenni: We both sent to two isolation rooms, in Tseung Kwan O hospital.
Wenni: At first we live in two rooms, but due to the lack of the isolation room, we moved together in the next day.
Wenni: In the second day.
Kecheng Fang: Okay.
Kecheng Fang: how was the treatment?
Kecheng Fang: So how were you being treated?
Kecheng Fang: Was it like any, like treating like a fever or treating like a cold was there anything special about the treatment.
Dominic: the doctor actually came in and, give us two options.
Dominic: So one is just, normal care plan.
Dominic: So just, care for the symptoms without treating the virus.
Dominic: The other is, they give us a choice to take a pill.
Dominic: Kaletra.
Wenni: Kaletra
Dominic: Which is a pill that is used to fight SARS in the past.
Dominic: it's also used for AIDS and SARS.
Dominic: So, she said that there's no guarantee, but if you want to take a risk, you know, they're willing to gamble with you.
Dominic: So both of us, we choose to take the pills.
Dominic: Yeah.
Dominic: So we have to take the pills every day.
Kecheng Fang: It seems that, Dominic spent about 12 or a dozen days longer than your wife in hospital?
Dominic: 47 days.
Kecheng Fang: 47 Days in total.
Kecheng Fang: That's really a long time.
Kecheng Fang: So, so yeah.
Kecheng Fang: So, so did the doctors give any like explanation why you stayed much longer than your life?
Dominic: no, actually, but, like in our board, like most of the female patients get discharged earlier, so majority of them are male patients.
Dominic: So it, I don't know the virus just like male patients, I guess.
Dominic: So, there's there's, there's no really solid explanation,
Kecheng Fang: We still know so little about this virus,actually.
Kecheng Fang: I want to ask you what's your feeling throughout this journey?
Kecheng Fang: Like you were, firstly, you were very shocked, right?
Kecheng Fang: You didn't really expect that you could be tested positive.
Kecheng Fang: And then did you feel any like fear or despair?
Kecheng Fang: Because we know so little about the disease, maybe.
Kecheng Fang: Did you ever have this kind of a feeling.
Dominic: Yeah.
Dominic: Yeah, definitely.
Dominic: you know, I'm fairly fearful, I don't want to lose my life, you know, and, like everything was so sudden.
Dominic: So, even if we thought that, Oh, like would we die from this, you know, but we're so young, like, would we, not see
Dominic: our families again, you know, Like all this has, certainly, you know, take place, but then after a while the doctor
Dominic: said like, the most critic time is over like that we don't sustain any damage in the lungs or in a major organ.
Dominic: So that's when we get a bit relief.
Dominic: Yeah.
Dominic: But then, the waiting process is, you know, it's hard to bear because every day you, you get tested.
Dominic: And every day the doctor say, Oh, you're still test positive.
Dominic: So you still have to stay here.
Dominic: So like every day you have a hope and every day you get to despair again.
Dominic: So it's quite hard to bear.
Kecheng Fang: So when did you get the news that, the most critical time has already passed.
Dominic: after a week or so
Wenni: I think two weeks, two weeks.
Wenni: Yeah.
Wenni: Yes.
Kecheng Fang: So that's, that means that the first one to two weeks was the worst.
Kecheng Fang: And then after that you are, much relieved and that's, waiting for being discharged
Kecheng Fang: what's your feel Wenni?
Kecheng Fang: Did you feel the same as your husband.
Wenni: Yes.
Wenni: And also, I was so scared to, never see my parents again.
Wenni: Cause I've been in Hong Kong for like nine years and my parents are still living in mainland China and due to the travel ban.
Wenni: They, they are not able to come to Hong Kong, even.
Wenni: I was, get infected.
Wenni: So I, at the time I was so scared that I will die in Hong Kong, and then I was not able to see them before I die.
Kecheng Fang: So when you were feeling much fearful, and even thinking of death, did you
Kecheng Fang: ever come with idea of like who to blame for this pandemic for the, for your situation?
Kecheng Fang: Did you think of blaming anyone for this.
Wenni: we decided to immigrate to Canada because of the recent situation in Hong Kong.
Wenni: We will lose our freedom.
Wenni: We will lose our rights.
Wenni: That's why we decided to immigrate.
Wenni: And that's why we get infected in the way of immigration.
Wenni: So.
Wenni: I think it is the Chinese government.
Wenni: I blame most.
Kecheng Fang: both of you were in the same room for most of your treatments in hospital, right?
Wenni: Yes.
Kecheng Fang: What's your daily conversation like during that time I'm hospital?
Kecheng Fang: What, what did you do?
Kecheng Fang: Can you go online?
Kecheng Fang: Can you use face Facebook, can you watch entertainment programs?
Kecheng Fang: Can you do all those things in hospital rooms?
Wenni: There is no wifi in there, but we can use our own signal of the cell phone, but it is limited.
Wenni: So we cannot surf online so much time.
Wenni: Mostly we watch TV, but there is only TVB in hospital.
Wenni: So we just watch the soap opera, talking about the Hong Kong police.
Wenni: It's very boring at the time, actually every day we have nothing to do.
Dominic: So actually our routine is quite structured, like, every day at 8:00 AM, they're bringing breakfast, take our temperatures.
Dominic: Usually after breakfast, the doctor will call to check up on us and then to bring us the test result from the previous day.
Dominic: And then we'll have some new tests.
Dominic: after that in the afternoon, I usually do some exercise or read a book and my wife usually took a nap, you know?
Dominic: And then, around six they bring in the dinner.
Dominic: So we have our day and you know, that's about it.
Dominic: Yeah.
Kecheng Fang: so you sleep early and then get up early
Wenni: yeah,
Kecheng Fang: Very healthy routines
Dominic: yeah,
Kecheng Fang: Yeah.
Kecheng Fang: So what was your interactions with, doctors, nurses and the care workers during that time?
Kecheng Fang: I guess they were like very well protected.
Dominic: So every day the care workers, they will come, they'll put on the full gear with the masks and
Dominic: gloves and protective clothing, and they'll come to our rooms to do some cleaning, take away the trash.
Dominic: And also they will mop, the nurse will come in to do the tests for us.
Dominic: The doctor hardly comes in.
Dominic: The doctor usually we just communicate over the phone.
Dominic: Yes.
Dominic: So she'll call us, inform us about, the test results and whether or not the, the pills are, you know, having effect
Dominic: or, and then we also tell them about the side effects and the doctor will help to match our side effects, you know?
Dominic: So, we, we don't get to see the doctor a lot.
Dominic: But we communicate over the phone usually.
Kecheng Fang: so you interacted most with the care workers right?
Dominic: Yes,
Wenni: yes.
Kecheng Fang: What did they say to you?
Kecheng Fang: What's your daily conversation like?
Wenni: well most of them are not, the professionals.
Wenni: They are middle age woman, but they are very, they are very kind and friendly.
Wenni: Yeah.
Wenni: Yes.
Wenni: since we lived there for a long time, yes.
Wenni: So we got more and more familiar.
Wenni: We always see each other and say, sometimes they will bring us some snacks and sometimes they even encourage us.
Wenni: Yeah.
Wenni: Yes.
Wenni: Yeah.
Wenni: They are very nice.
Kecheng Fang: Is it allowed that they bring you things from outside?
Dominic: Occasionally.
Dominic: Yes, because it's, it's somehow it's coming up from their own pockets.
Dominic: So, you know, we don't, we don't want to insist.
Dominic: Right.
Dominic: But at the same time, the meals in the hospital is very bland and it's almost the same, like every day.
Dominic: So it's good to have some outside food.
Dominic: And once in awhile,
Wenni: It's also things we are, we got infected, so we ask them to wear mask even in the rooms.
Wenni: So every time they came in, actually, I, I don't want to talk to them to increase their risk of getting infected.
Wenni: But they just, talk to us, initiate the conversation.
Wenni: So which means a lot to us, I think.
Kecheng Fang: Oh, that's very nice of them to do so.
Kecheng Fang: Talking about the help and support, did you feel that you got sufficient help from the government?
Wenni: we don't think so.
Wenni: we didn't receive any financial, or other support from the government.
Kecheng Fang: What about the community and your friends?
Dominic: well friends, like, you know, we talk to them like, through the internet and they give us the emotional support, the care about us, they ask about us.
Dominic: So, but then they can never come and visit us.
Dominic: So not even our parents.
Dominic: So, so the most they can do is bring us some food, but they can only leave it at the door so someone can bring it in to us.
Kecheng Fang: So I guess that was, quite difficult for you psychologically, right?
Wenni: Yeah.
Kecheng Fang: Cause you were forced to be isolated from the world.
Wenni: yeah, since I can't talk too much of my fear with my parents.
Wenni: So mostly I talked to my friends, they gave me a lot of emotional supports.
Kecheng Fang: what were you hearing during your days in hospital?
Dominic: Like the sound of, like the, the air conditioner and also the sound of the negative pressure,
Dominic: the negative pressure that there's a, there's like, it's like an engine is like a small engine.
Dominic: So it, it goes on like every single day.
Dominic: because for me, I also wrote it on my blog.
Dominic: So, after I got discharged, like I heard that birds chipping.
Dominic: The birds, and I heard like cars crossing, and these are, you know, very new to me at that moment.
Dominic: And I felt like the, the sunshine, like sunshine on my skin, it felt really warm.
Dominic: And, you know, I felt like, Oh, okay.
Dominic: I haven't felt this for a long, long time.
Kecheng Fang: Hmm.
Dominic: you know, these are some, you
Dominic: Something
Kecheng Fang: used to be ordinary became totally new to you.
Dominic: exactly.
Kecheng Fang: Did you like, get any new ideas of the world, the life during those dozen of
Kecheng Fang: days in hospital, because when people have nothing to do, maybe they can become a philosopher.
Wenni: Actually.
Wenni: I was a sales person.
Wenni: I sell insurance.
Wenni: So I was fairly stressful.
Wenni: Most of my, during the last two years, but by the time I was got into the hospital, I, I found nothing is more important than my parents and my family members.
Wenni: So yes, now I was.
Wenni: very peaceful even I had no business at all.
Wenni: Yes.
Wenni: Cause I think like, our career, our job is just part of our life.
Wenni: We should focus more on our family.
Dominic: So for me as well, like, you know, once you experience something like near death experience, it really makes you reprioritize what
Dominic: you value most in life that would definitely, I put my weight to my family, you know, I should spend more time with them, love them more.
Dominic: A positive thing about the experience is I get to read some of the books that I always wanted to read, but I never got a chance to, so I read like three books.
Dominic: and then, you know, this is something that I enjoyed the past, but I was just too busy with my life, so I didn't get a chance.
Dominic: So it's very good to, you know, to go back to these passions, you know, and also also learn to do yoga.
Dominic: so I think it's just, you would take better care of your own body, your health.
Dominic: Because even if you gain the whole world, but if you lose health, you lose yourself.
Dominic: there's no point to it.
Kecheng Fang: That's quite touching.
Kecheng Fang: You still get positive things out of this definitely bad experience.
Kecheng Fang: so I hope, you have already fully recovered.
Kecheng Fang: is that so, or did you have a, you talk about side effects?
Kecheng Fang: Did you, did you have any like residual effects?
Dominic: yeah.
Dominic: So I have some impairment with my smell sense.
Dominic: So, I'm still going to the smell clinic to follow up on that.
Dominic: So, you know, it's, it's, it's not damaged, but it's, it's slightly impaired.
Kecheng Fang: does that mean that you cannot smell anything or can not smell a certain kind of taste?
Dominic: No, it's, it's just that, it, it smells different.
Dominic: Like, you know, it smells different than what it should be.
Kecheng Fang: So like spicy thing does not smell like spicy at all.
Dominic: something like that.
Dominic: Yeah.
Dominic: So I'm going through some treatment for that.
Dominic: The sensories take, they can grow back.
Dominic: Yeah,
Kecheng Fang: Oh, okay.
Kecheng Fang: That's good to know.
Kecheng Fang: Yeah.
Kecheng Fang: And that's the thing, it's a very special experience, to smell something diferently.
Kecheng Fang: Did you experience any discrimination after recovering from COVID-19.
Wenni: Yes, two weeks or three weeks ago, I had a sore throat and then I go to the GP.
Wenni: And, I declared that I had the history of COVID-19 and, they immediately put on the shield and, uh, the doctor said that he rejects to see me.
Wenni: And they told me to go to ANE, even I being discharged for three months and I had no traveling history.
Wenni: But I, I can just go to A&E and the, when I arrived, I stayed the whole night to, to get to test again.
Wenni: because I had the history.
Wenni: Yes.
Wenni: But, it's, it's turned out.
Wenni: It's just a normal cold.
Kecheng Fang: Can you explain a little bit about the GP and A&E?
Wenni: General practitioner, GP, and, A&E is accident and emergency
Kecheng Fang: Are they in public hospitals?
Wenni: The GP is in private clinic.
Wenni: And, A&E is in public hospitals.
Kecheng Fang: So the public hospital cannot reject any, patients based on this, but private clinics have the right to do that.
Wenni: Yes.
Wenni: But I need to wait for whole night to get a test in the public hospital.
Kecheng Fang: Did you have any, discrimination experienced, Dominic?
Dominic: Yeah.
Dominic: I, I think, it's, it's understandable because it's a new virus and you don't know, like, you know, it could cause death in certain cases.
Dominic: So I think it's understandable that people are worried.
Dominic: People are scared, people are afraid, you know?
Dominic: So, I know, I remember one experience where, our neighbors, like they, they saw me coming out.
Dominic: And they were also opening the door there.
Dominic: They saw me, they slammed the door immediately.
Dominic: They went back to their own home.
Dominic: I think it's understandable.
Dominic: So I don't really blame them.
Dominic: So they're still because you don't know what would happen.
Dominic: And there are cases with, virus coming back with some survivors.
Kecheng Fang: Our podcast actually focuses on change, this pandemic changed many things.
Kecheng Fang: So talk a little about your original plan for this year.
Kecheng Fang: It was, immigrating to Canada, right?
Kecheng Fang: To starting a new life in Canada.
Kecheng Fang: so what was the change to your life plan for this year?
Kecheng Fang: And maybe in future are you still planning to go to Canada?
Wenni: We'll still go to Canada, but not this year, we postponed the plan since, the unemployment rate in Canada is quite high.
Wenni: We, so we are worried.
Wenni: We can't find a job there.
Wenni: So, we leased our house, for one year and to see how it goes next year.
Kecheng Fang: so you are currently, working in Hong Kong now.
Wenni: Yes.
Wenni: So we, we decided to stay in Hong Kong for, this year.
Kecheng Fang: So what's your day like now in Hong Kong, what's a typical day like?
Wenni: Both of us are now working as social worker, so we need to see our client,
Wenni: but due to the COVID-19, we now work from home for like two to three days every week.
Wenni: And to go to office for two days per week.
Wenni: but mostly we just talk with our clients via phone.
Wenni: We used to meet them face to face.
Wenni: but now we are not encouraged to do so.
Kecheng Fang: Yeah, because starting from early July, there was a new wave of, this pandemic in Hong Kong.
Kecheng Fang: So how do both of you think about this, current status of this pandemic in Hong Kong?
Dominic: I should even feel very fatigue about it because it's been, it's been a long, long time.
Dominic: So there's no end to this.
Dominic: Like we don't see an end to this.
Dominic: So, we just have to be extra careful every single day.
Dominic: Every time we wash our hands, wear a mask.
Dominic: but you know, it's, it's, it's getting more and more difficult because you have to stay home all the time and tried to get work done, but it's not as effective.
Dominic: So, it it's, it's getting, you know, really retired and we really hope that this will all blow over very soon.
Kecheng Fang: What's your opinion, Wenni?
Wenni: Actually I think it's a failure of the government's policy, which caused the new wave.
Wenni: some of my friends, they came to Hong Kong from mainland China.
Wenni: They didn't need to do any test before they came to Hong Kong and they can stay home with a family member.
Wenni: But their family members they're free to go to everywhere.
Wenni: So I think that's why, there is a new wave.
Kecheng Fang: But, people also saying that if you really want to get more stricter regulations on people's daily life, then it will cause a lot of inconvenience.
Kecheng Fang: Right?
Kecheng Fang: So actually it seems that it's quite efficient for mainland China government to control the pandemic.
Kecheng Fang: Especially for example, recently starting from June, the recent wave in Beijing, and it was a controlled
Kecheng Fang: quite quickly, but of course the cost is that, many people did not have the freedom to go out at all.
Kecheng Fang: So what do you think of this, balance between controlling the pandemic effectively and also not disturbing the ordinary people's lives?
Wenni: Actually I don't know why China can do that.
Wenni: it's impossible for us to not go out for, for a period of time.
Kecheng Fang: Yeah, they can literally lock people's doors.
Kecheng Fang: Right.
Wenni: yes.
Wenni: I don't know, but it's, it's definitely what I, it's not what I want.
Wenni: And I think it's hard to use this method in, in Hong Kong.
Wenni: In Hong Kong we have the stress of survive.
Wenni: Especially with, cause I was working as a social work.
Wenni: I see some people say they need to work or they can't survive.
Kecheng Fang: do you have any, like, other thoughts to share with, with our audience, especially from your own experience?
Wenni: Actually I posted my reflection of the experience online and recently some people, they
Wenni: come to contact me because they are suspected or they are diagnosed with COVID-19 recently.
Wenni: So I think most of them are very scared.
Wenni: So I want to tell whoever listening to this, if you are suspected, if you are
Wenni: diagnosed, do not be so panic or do not be so scared .Most of us can survive the virus.
Kecheng Fang: And you can get, actually get positive things out of it.
Wenni: Yes.
Dominic: So for me, I would say, first of all, I think, this virus has been going on for some time now, but now is not the time to relax.
Dominic: Keep doing a safety measure, wash your hands, you know, wear a cover.
Dominic: If possible, keep social distancing.
Dominic: I think, it's a long battle.
Dominic: It's a long battle and, you just really have to hold the defense, you know, even now.
Dominic: I know it's hard to bear, but you really need to hold on because you never know when you will get it.
Dominic: Like for us, we don't know exactly how we got it, but we got it.
Dominic: So, you always have to be cautious, you know, and second of all, I think at sometimes it's also good to stop and kind of reflect on your life.
Dominic: Like, what do you truly value?
Dominic: What is important for you?
Dominic: Are you really doing the, working towards what you value or you're working towards your goal or just letting life getting by?
Dominic: You know, these are some really good questions, important questions, which I reflected on when I was in the hospital alone.
Kecheng Fang: Okay.
Kecheng Fang: Good.
Kecheng Fang: Thank you.
Kecheng Fang: I will be talking with you after two to three months to see what's your life will be during that time.
Kecheng Fang: And how will our world will be after two to three months.
Kecheng Fang: This was episode two with Kecheng Fang.
Kecheng Fang: Stay tuned.for the following episode of Record of Change when we will hear Rey in Manilla.
Kecheng Fang: Rey is a flight attendant at Philippines Airlines.
Kecheng Fang: As very few flights were allowedduring the lockdown in the Phillippines, Rey took on side jobs as a barista at a coffee shop and a disinfection officer.
Kecheng Fang: Follow us on your favourite podcast provider, and find out more about the stories behind on Twitter, Instagram, YouTube or our website, recordofchange.com.
Kecheng Fang: This podcast is implemented by and with members of the Bosch Alumni Network.